Music Halls in Ashton/Manchester c1917

[lindaterrett]

My great uncle, Harry Hall, (b1896 Ashton u Lyne, d1972 Los Angeles, California, USA) was a music hall artist in Ashton/ Manchester around 1917. As a child of 7 he was injured on a fairground ride in Ashton leading to the amputation of one leg below the knee.

He joined the Music Halls as a step dancer with a wooden leg Around this time he had an affair with a Welsh comedienne, Gladys Morgan and this resulted in a daughter, Jessie, who was later brought up by her grandmother, Harry's mother, in Ashton.

Harry (stage name Jack Joyce) emigrated to the USA in 1919, aged 23 where he was an entertainer/actor. He appeared in a black & white silent movie in 1925 (New Lives for Old) released by Paramount.

He went on to work in the USA, Mexico and Australia - later becoming a "Theatrical Manager/Producer".

Does anyone know where I may obtain info about his Music Hall career in the UK or his career in the USA. He died in Los Angeles, California in 1972, and I am wondering if there are any web sites that list actors and/or Theatrical Managers.

So far, this has proved difficult for me.

Here's hoping .....

[Woody]

From my initial searches, there was at least one other person using the name ‘Jack Joyce’ in the entertainment business of the era. He was exclusively a circus animal trainer whose career is spelled out on-line in great detail. I presume this is one of the prime contributory factors to the blockage ?

The US entertainment trade paper ‘Billboard’ might be a resource you can try. Google ‘music hall and vaudeville society Jack Joyce’ and you’ll get access to quite a few copies that are searchable online. ‘Billboard’ reports a Jack Joyce to have been working with Buffalo Bill’s Wild West troupe in 1909. Then, in 1915 it tells us that “Jack Joyce was working his Wild West in circus and music halls in Sweden. Jack closed his own circus in Denmark shortly after the war broke out”.

If your Harry Hall didn’t migrate to the USA until about 1919, it’s highly unlikely that any of the countless internet references to venues at which Jack Joyce performed will be relevant because they’re invariably talking about the circus animal trainer (b 1876).

If you don’t already have the information, you can track the Hall family’s BMD history (including Jessie until her death in 2000) at www.cheshirebmd.org.uk. Seems Jessie had her share of misfortune being widowed after only twelve months of her first marriage to Norman Leigh. She then re-married in 1942 and her second husband was born 1919 at Newcastle upon Tyne.

Apart from the 1925 film, I found a single further reference (‘The Author Speaks’) to a co-authored play: “Ransome” by Jack Joyce (pseud of Harry Hall) incorporating the play entitled World of Make Believe by M Linder copyright 1 c. Mar 23, 1933; D21676; Harry Hall and Esther Feibish and Mark Linder, New York.

Have you tried asking at www.britishmusichallsociety.com/index/links.html ?

Not really what you wanted, I know, but if neither of us can find on-line information there’s a fair possibility that it might not be there to find. I’ll have a hunt for hard copy stuff in the Manchester library next time I’m there.

[Woody]

Just out of interest, I continued to search USA records for a while and it wasn't difficult to find several assorted bits of documentary evidence for Harry Hall's geographical whereabouts at specific times. I haven't done much with the documents except download them in case you don't already have them. At least the dates tell you where he was or where he'd been at these specific times which might help you focus your USA research.

For starters, he first migrated on the SS ‘Haverford’ which sailed from Liverpool on 25 October 1919 and docked at Philadelphia, Pennsylvania in early November 1919. On the manifest he was heading for New Bedford, Massachusetts but that has been scrubbed out to be replaced in pencil by ‘New York’. His nearest relative is given as Mrs Alice Hall of 64 Hereford Street, Ashton under Lyne and he gives his profession as ‘artiste’ so he'd evidently made up his mind about what he intended to do before he set out. He made another trip home in 1921 and yet another in 1927. By 1940 he was returning from Sydney, Australia when his occupation has transformed into theatrical producer, There are various Border Crossing records in between all these dates but there is also a Canadian sailor of the same name so I've tended to ignore crossings up that end of the USA.

If you want the originals of documents I downloaded, just use the forum's private messaging system to provide me with an address to which I can forward them.

[lindaterrett]

Hi Woody

Thanks for taking the time to research and reply.

I was already aware of the other "Jack Joyce" - the circus performer (makes for a bit of confusion). The info about "Billboard" and about Jessie was helpful (I hadn't been able to trace her very successfully using Ancestry).

Using Ancestry searches I have found his name on passenger lists across the Atlantic and also sailing from Sydney, as you mentioned. I also found border crossings to and from Mexico which appear to be him. I agree that the Harry Hall who travelled between Canada and the US seems to be someone else.

It would be interesting, if you have anything else I may be interested in, if you would email them to me, however I have searched the Help button on this web site and couldn't find how to do Private Messaging (their instructions don't seem to work). Maybe you can help?

Your reference to a play by Harry is interesting - I will follow that up. Also the links to the Cheshire BMD and British Music Hall Society are helpful.

All the best,
Linda

[Woody]

Hi Linda

You do need to be logged in to use the message system so that's the first job.

Once you're into the page that displays the message-board, click on the user-name of the member you want to contact (in this case 'Woody'), and that will open a new window with the member's profile. On the top line in the new window you'll see the notice 'send personal message', so just click on that and away you go.

I get notified by e-mail when there's a message for me, but I think you also have to click on something else to make sure that happens. You'll know whether you get notified because I've just sent you a message to test the system.